Critic Calls Skate Site "Racist"

[luv2laf]

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Black Rinks

” page is, (as far as we know), the most complete and comprehensive listing of skating rinks owned and/or managed by Black women and men.  The most visited feature on RST, it currently lists 20 Black owned rinks along with three that are under Black management.  The most recent additions to the list include Treo Roller Rink in Louisville, Kentucky, and D'Light Skate N Palace in Temple Hills, Maryland.  Recently, a site visitor named Renee took offense to the listing which she found to be “racist.”  In a brief email message, she wrote:


     “For a race that screams about racism continually don't you think this is racist?  I do.  If I were to start an  association of "White owned/managed" rinks the ACLU and Jesse Jackson would have a field day in the media  and courts.  So if you don't have any problem with me referring to "White owned/managed" rinks I suggest you stop segregating the races in what is supposed to be family oriented entertainment.”


Some others may question why RST has a clear focus on roller skating from a 'Black perspective', so maybe a few examples will make it clearer why RST stands for what it does.

In the TV industry, there is a channel called Black Entertainment Television (BET) and although the station has its share of programming critics, its purpose is to provide  entertainment, news, views and shows which target, and are of particular interest to, a Black audience.  This audience is not catered to by the mainstream industry and even the NAACP, in their annual TV Diversity Reports, has found that the television world has a long way to go in overcoming its long history of being – in act, even if not in name –   “White Entertainment Television.”  When you think about it, there would never have been a need for a BET had Black people not been under represented, negatively portrayed or excluded from decision making in the industry. 

Another example is the large number of Black newspapers in the country.  There would be no need or market for them if news of interest to Blacks was more prominently and regularly featured in the nation's major publications, which – like the TV industry - primarily target a White audience or consumer.

The same examples can be applied to the growing audience for Spanish language TV and radio stations and newspapers all over America.

In the same way, RST is somewhat like an Ebony Magazine of roller skating sites with news, features and a focus that is targeted toward the world of Black Skaters.  Is that a crime?  No it isn't as there are any number of sites  to choose from which have more of a multi-cultural or mainstream focus, if that is what a reader desires.  No one is forced to visit, like or read RST's features but it is somewhat arrogant for one dissenter to expect, just because they personally hold a negative view, that the site focus and purpose (much enjoyed by others)  should be changed or done away with. 

Variety is the spice of life and even though some view RST's focus as “racist,” others may view Renee's position as one exemplary of  the White-privilege mentality that still permeates this society.   Some in the majority population seem unable to appreciate the value, uniqueness and right for non-Whites to express themselves culturally, ethnically – and in a way they have determined for themselves - within a society that has, for hundreds of years, been primarily governed by (and for the benefit of) Caucasians.

Renee, erroneously viewed RST's LISTING of black owned/managed rinks as an ASSOCIATION, which it is not, and suggested that RST stop “segregating the races,” as though RST is responsible for the bias, discrimination and segregation that has long gone on in this country and in the roller skating world.

Only a few years ago, RST interviewed Harry Mayo, manager of Hoover Skate Arena in Dayton, Ohio, and he stated that racism is still alive and well in what Renee calls “family oriented entertainment.”  The following is an excerpt from RST's  (Only BH members are allowed to view links)
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Sept./Oct. 2003 feature

about that family operated rink:


     Racism in the Skate World:

     ....As proud as Harry is of Hoover’s history and longevity, there is one thing about being in the business that greatly disturbs him.  He receives numerous calls throughout the year from White rink owners who are looking to sell their rinks because they state the rinks have “gone Black” or they are “getting too many Blacks” coming to their facilities. 

     These rink owners are not aware, when they call, that Hoover is Black owned and operated and sometimes they even use the “N-word” in describing their dilemma to Harry.  This causes him to get very upset, but what puzzles him even more  is that some of these rinks are being utilized for a number of the National Skate Parties that have become so popular with Black skaters. 

     “It happened right here in Dayton.  It amazes me how they could not wait to rent out the skating rink they are not welcome at but because it represented a night for revenue, the owners said ‘come on down’....As you get a lot of these skating parties that travel from city to city, a lot of them are held at rinks that Blacks weren't even welcome at a few years ago..... People forget history, but we know the history very well........”


That was only three years ago and shows that even though things have improved over the decades, they are still not what they should be even in what is supposed to be “family oriented entertainment.”  RST also has an archived July 2003 feature entitled “(Only BH members are allowed to view links)
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Integrating Atlanta's Rinks

,”  in which Mike “Gizz” Willis recounts how he was one of the first Blacks in Georgia to integrate, previously segregated, Greenbriar Skating Center (GSC) during the 1960s.  He also bore witness to the extent some Whites went to during that time to maintain segregation in what should have been “family oriented entertainment.”  The following is an excerpt:


     “......Blacks began skating at GSC in the late 1960s........ one of the two rinks at that time which allowed [them] to skate.  The other place was called River Rink which was built specifically for Blacks.  That is the place Gizz first skated indoors as a teenager but unfortunately the rink ended up closing due to violence and fighting.

     When River Rink closed, Black skaters found another place that would allow them to skate, Ponce De Leon Rink, but they soon found they were not welcomed by neighborhood residents.

     “Whites got mad at us because we started to come there and they burned the rink down just to keep us out..............”

Were it not for sites like RST, it is doubtful that this type of roller skating history would be known or recorded, as it is not what mainstream roller skating sites choose to focus on.  This history also proves that not everyone in the roller skating world is, or was, interested in integration with Black skaters or providing a “family oriented” skating atmosphere that would include them.

Renee and other RST critics, in looking at the facts, will have to admit that it is incorrect to label this site or any of its features as “racist” or guilty of  causing segregation, when racism, segregation and discrimination in the skating world existed long before RST started in 2002 and is still existent today – not from this site - but from a number of White rink owners, operators, managers and skaters across the nation.

We encourage Renee to take her campaign against racism and segregation to where it rightfully belongs instead of becoming offended because a site dares to have a LISTING, (not an association), of Black owned and managed rinks, and dares to have a Black focus which is rarely afforded in the overall skating industry. 

RST continues to salute and encourage support for the relatively few Black owned and managed rinks which are like needles in a haystack when compared with the hundreds of rinks in America, most owned by members of the majority population.

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http://rollerskatingtoday.com/blackrinks.html]Black Rinks

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Rink of the Month

  features.

[pipwax]

This is very interesting information. I can imagine that some of the rinks the we have skated at for the national skate parties fell this way, but I never was able to identify the strange feeling in the air.  Yes you are right that we have to have various forms of media, entertainment, and establishments to accommodate Afro Americans.  I have even found this to be true with satellite radio, they have a station  called the Power, that speaks on black issues. Things that you never here in the mainstream media. I have no doubt that racism is still alive in America today. They created this situation.

[luv2laf]

hmmmmm @ "...I never was able to identify the strange feeling in the air....."

do you recall what cities/states you were skating in when you felt this?  i think harry mayo from hoover hit it on the head when he said because it "represents a night for revenue" that's why a lot of these rinks are opening their doors.  sure, business is business but i guess we should always remember not to get it twisted.   a lot of these places love the money, not the people spending it or the music those people like to listen to or the style of skating those people enjoy.

[GeoLes]

Actally, I have a mixed opionion here.

In the macro world:

If the roles were reversed and publications, like the Wall Street Journal began calling themselves "White Publications", it would seem very racist.

In the Micro world:
There are other "ethnic" publications like "The Jewish Press", There are Irish, Polish, Russian, etc.  In that sense, Black is just a way of reserving the media for a specific ethnic voice, which is in fact an important service.  All ethnicities benefit from understanding the others' point of view, needs and concerns.  It draws us closer together as we seek to understand each other.

So, in the final analysis, while there is some cause to raise an eyebrow, it ultimately leaves room for diversity that we all can benefit from.

[GeoLes]

I heard on the radio this morning where someone sent a letter in to the radio peson about Chinese Restraurants suggesting that we should not patronize them because we never see any of our people working with or for them.  Supplies are purchased from Chinese sources, etc.  In short that have never done anything for us, so why should we support them with our revenue?

At first I thoght.  "Good point".  I do a number of charity bike rides throught the year and approached someone from my local car was for donations/sponsorship.  I was told that "They don't give nobody nuthin'".  - This is the exact quote from the cashier.  I no longer get my car washed there.

But, on second thought.

Last time I visited my local Soul Food restaurant, I asked the Asian waitress for an extra portion of peach cobler.  I recall asking the Pakistani gentleman behind the counter of the Golden Krust restaurant if the Curry Goat was any good. - You get the point.  We have our own "pockets of segregation" within our business practices.  Should other ethnic groups not purchase goods and services from us?

Just  some random thoughts.

[luv2laf]

I heard on the radio this morning where someone sent a letter in to the radio peson about Chinese Restraurants suggesting that we should not patronize them because we never see any of our people working with or for them.  Supplies are purchased from Chinese sources, etc.  In short that have never done anything for us, so why should we support them with our revenue?

At first I thoght.  "Good point".  I do a number of charity bike rides throught the year and approached someone from my local car was for donations/sponsorship.  I was told that "They don't give nobody nuthin'".  - This is the exact quote from the cashier.  I no longer get my car washed there.

But, on second thought.

Last time I visited my local Soul Food restaurant, I asked the Asian waitress for an extra portion of peach cobler.  I recall asking the Pakistani gentleman behind the counter of the Golden Krust restaurant if the Curry Goat was any good. - You get the point.  We have our own "pockets of segregation" within our business practices.  Should other ethnic groups not purchase goods and services from us?

Just  some random thoughts.

hmmmmm - interesting question.  i wouldn't say blacks shouldn't patronize chinese restaurants for the reason the letter writer gave but i do question why chinese restaurants get so much black business and many are located in black neighborhoods, when it could be argued that black people don't support their own restaurants to the same degree.  it could also be argued that some/many chinese business owners (restaurants, beauty supply stores, etc.) really don't respect black people much which is another reason i'd question the rationale of supporting such businesses.

as far as the soul food restaurant flip-the-script example, i would surmise that most of them get their supplies, food stuffs, equipment and necessities from non-black owned sources so other ethnic groups, particularly whites, can know for sure that they're patronizing a place that is enriching someone in their own community. whereas, with the chinese restaurant - if they're mostly purchasing their needs from asian sources - they're supporting their own, which should be an example for blacks.  whites do it, asians do it, god knows the mexicans and chicanos are doing it to primarily benefit their own communities, but for some reason it's a problem for blacks to do it for themselves or it's a problem, like with RST's critic, when black people attempt to do it for themselves.

[luv2laf]

Actally, I have a mixed opionion here.

In the macro world:

If the roles were reversed and publications, like the Wall Street Journal began calling themselves "White Publications", it would seem very racist.

well, i don't know.  if the histories were the same, would you still say this?  i.e., if blacks built & structured a society that was based on the degradation, exclusion, and disregard of all non-black interests, would it seem racist for whites to come along start their own white newspapers, tv stations, etc.?  as it is, the wall st. journal doesn't have to formally start calling itself a white publication because that's basically what it started out as - garnered toward the interests of whites - and that's primarily what it remains today - i think.   because of where i stand on the issue, i personally don't have a problem with anybody wanting to start a "white" this or that, or something with "european" in the name.  i really don't have a problem with it or think it's racist.

In the Micro world:
There are other "ethnic" publications like "The Jewish Press", There are Irish, Polish, Russian, etc.  In that sense, Black is just a way of reserving the media for a specific ethnic voice, which is in fact an important service.  All ethnicities benefit from understanding the others' point of view, needs and concerns.  It draws us closer together as we seek to understand each other.

So, in the final analysis, while there is some cause to raise an eyebrow, it ultimately leaves room for diversity that we all can benefit from.

agreed.

[luv2laf]

renee, the critic, had more to say after receiving a copy of the RST op-ed:

It's very clear you do support the continuation of racism, just look at the pictures from how many years ago that are attached to your email.  Get over it.  I did not cause racism and you most likely were not even around during those times.  It is absolutely amazing how people from other countries come to America to WORK and make a better life for their families.  Yet, blacks have been America for how long and the only excuse they have for not being successful and wanted is racism.  It's not our problem that the black community has such a hard time supporting their families.  Maybe they should put effort into the things they want for their families and themselves instead of blaming white people for holding them back.
Have a great day.

[LEsmoothj]

Renee (the critic) reveals her agenda in her last message. What have all those digressions to do with the issue of the Black skating experience in America? My experience with people like her is that it is impossible to have a reasoned dialogue. They just say whatever comes to mind. If you notice, she does not address any of the points you raised in response to her assertions. No matter what you say, she will just respond with another unrelated/illogical and probably nonsensical retort. Don't waste your time. It's not worth it in my humble opinion.

[GeoLes]

I have to agree.

Read Proverbs 26:4,5

[luv2laf]

a new RST visitor chimed in on the issue with this as posted on the site:

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Rebuttal from Youth Leader

Site visitor Kirreck Williams was led to RST after doing an online search for Black owned skating rinks. As a youth advisor for a group which sponsors trips for students to Historically Black Colleges & Universities, he was looking for a Black rink to support in the Atlanta area where the group could take a break from business and enjoy some recreation. During his RST visit, he took time to read Renee's statements which disturbed him to the point of issuing the following rebuttal:


Why are you even addressing or giving Renee a voice on your vehicle? This is the new rhetoric of the right-wing zealots, proclaim others racist to divert their own racist agenda. Renee's own ideology speaks for itself by capitalizing 'WORK' in her barrage, to insinutate the obviously false stereotype that most Black people don't. What Renee also conveniently leaves out of her idiotic manifesto is that those very same people who come over, all primarily spend money in their own community among themselves. That's how strong communities are built in America, has been that way since the great European immigration.
Are Italian-Americans racist for having UNICO? Are Jews bigoted for advertising their businesses among their people? Are Asians? What about White-owned companies that specialize in advertising business towards Asian - are they racists, too?

I live in an urban city in New Jersey, primarily made up of immigrant ethnic groups and always has been. From the Irish, Italians, Polish, Cuban and Jews of old to the most recent Haitian, Russians, Columbians, and other South Americans. All of the groups, past and present, have their own periodicals and media outlets that highlight their own businesses for their people to support.

Another clear sign of Renee's prejudice. She insinuates that advertising Black-owned businesses is promoting separating the races - funny, no one said these business services aren't open to all Americans unlike some White-owned establishments of the past. Are Kosher delis only for Jews? Are Italian-owned restaurants only frequented by Italians? Of course not. For many decades now, Blacks and other groups have had no problem with patronizing White owned establishments, why would she have that problem with Black-owned venues? What makes America so great is its diversity. One of the few places in the world where you can maintain ethnicity and be part of a greater common population of being American. But you have to support your own community first to maintain your place in that bigger picture. Atlanta, of all places, proves the power of supporting Black owned businesses is the key to success of our community as with any other. Don't let people like Renee use their tricks to deny us ours.

Kirreck Williams
Elizabeth, NJ

[GeoLes]

Very well stated.

Part of the problem is that racism is an integral part of  American society. You see it in our class and economic divisions.  When we try to address social issues, we often find ourselves separating races and painting whole people groups with abroad bruhs because the social issues often become synomymous with racial stereo types.  By and large, this is not really true, but the perceptions are still strongly ingrained in us all (Asians are good at math and good martial artists, Indian are tech whizes, Italians women are great cooks; black are great at sports and dancing). Many of these stereotypes may raise and eyebrow today because we are more enlightened today than in previousl generations, but there is still a strong belief that these things are true if you look at representation within the various industries.  This, of course, is a selective observation.  There are a great many exceptions to the rules we think we observe.

I see a lot of residual race myth in the heart of the oped editorial.  These observations are merely reflections of her paradyne.  Because she observes and writes about it does not mean that we have to buy what see is selling.   We owe her a debt of gratitude however.  She has given us a chance to look at ourselves and think.  As this forum has already demonstrated, we can agree and disagree with parts of her opinion.  Only by disecting these arguments can we get at real truths.  We can also face some of the harsher realities (like the residual racism that resides within us - nyself included) and take steps to move beyond it.

"Go ahead and free yourself" - Fantasia

[luv2laf]

I see a lot of residual race myth in the heart of the oped editorial.  These observations are merely reflections of her paradyne.  Because she observes and writes about it does not mean that we have to buy what see is selling.   We owe her a debt of gratitude however.  She has given us a chance to look at ourselves and think. 

if you are referring to the piece i wrote ("critic calls skate site racist") i would certainly be interested in knowing which parts of the op ed you consider to be "race myth."

i find your post to be somewhat curious or strange - but okay. 

[GeoLes]

Here's an example of a negative perception (from the white point of view, of course)

Consider this quote:

-----------------------------------

"Racism in the Skate World:

     ....As proud as Harry is of Hoover’s history and longevity, there is one thing about being in the business that greatly disturbs him.  He receives numerous calls throughout the year from White rink owners who are looking to sell their rinks because they state the rinks have “gone Black” or they are “getting too many Blacks” coming to their facilities. 

     These rink owners are not aware, when they call, that Hoover is Black owned and operated and sometimes they even use the “N-word” in describing their dilemma to Harry.  This causes him to get very upset, but what puzzles him even more  is that some of these rinks are being utilized for a number of the National Skate Parties that have become so popular with Black skaters. 

     “It happened right here in Dayton.  It amazes me how they could not wait to rent out the skating rink they are not welcome at but because it represented a night for revenue, the owners said ‘come on down’....As you get a lot of these skating parties that travel from city to city, a lot of them are held at rinks that Blacks weren't even welcome at a few years ago..... People forget history, but we know the history very well........”

----------------------------------


Please see the last paragraph above - "It amazes me how they could not wait to rent out a skating fink the they are not welcome at"??.   What makes them think they are not welcome there?  Nothing but the absence of their own kind (in their own eyes, that is).  I used to skate all over the North East region and skated in all sorts of venues (even figure and dance skating), all types of music and have yet to feel unwelcome at any rink.  There are a host of "non-blacks" who frequent the rinks I attend.  Anyone who loves skating and love the music is welcome.

This is an example of the perceived racism I am referring to.  It is not a fact on our part, but on the part of the non-black person intimidated to enter the "roller-party" atmosphere because of the black faces and genre.

I recall a funny line from Rocky II, when he begins training with Apollo against Mr' T's character - Clubber Lang.  They go into Apollo's gym to work out and Rocky's brother Paulie is very uncomfortable among all these black faces.  He starts spouting off inuendos until  Rocky tells him.

 "Hey Paulie, Don't git "mentally lirregular on me'.

(Funny line, but the point is Paulie was intimidated to be on the all black turf.)  That's the false perception the writer is expressing.  -

Unless I misread the tone of the original post.

[luv2laf]

hmmm - i'm not really getting your point geo.  the owner of hoover made his comments based on the fact that some of those white rink owners were the same ones calling him trying to sell their rinks because they had "gone black."  these same owners sometimes used the n-word in talking to him about their situation because they assumed he was also white.  his point is that some of the national skate "parties" are held at some of these same rinks where the owners obviously view blacks as n!iggers and are trying to get rid of their rinks because there are so many blacks coming to them.  does that sound like the mentality of people who are welcoming of blacks?  sure, they open their doors to anybody who pays the green dollars but clearly they don't want to be around blacks and would prefer that black people weren't at their rink.  why else would they be selling their rinks for the reason that they've "gone black?"